Monday, July 23, 2007

Balancing Bud's Bar

Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea culpa.
Sorry folks. As so many of you have pointed out we didn't get in the Bud's Bar story over the weekend.
In the interest of being fair and balanced though we wanted some reaction from at least one township supervisor as to the comments coming forth from Bud's owner.
Stay tuned. It's on its way.

28 comments:

Anonymous said...

Hey Stan, Take a ride to Arby's at Schracks corner they have a picture hanging showing Bud's Bar as a Post Office. Maybe the Federal Government can purchase the property for a couple of mil. like they did on Audubon Road from Toll Brothers. Do you really think you are going to find a Supervisor that will tell you why they did the ordinance change? Very interesting.

Anonymous said...

Mr. Huskey, When the voting was made for excepting the conditional use for the CVS Supervisors Dininny, Kearney and Dougherty voted for, Supervisor Hager opposed and Supervisor Sassu was absent. I guess the only honest answer you can get is that of Supervisor Dininny. When Dougherty and Kearney decide to run in 2009 they can tell the public why they voted for CVS and Commerce.

Pampered in Providence said...

After reading Today's TH story on Bud's Bar, and if Mr. Dedominic is truthful, it would appear that he has a case for the Lower Providence Township Zoning Hearing Board. Case being, he has a hardship with the loss of business, and an offer by a bank to buy his property for many times over what he paid for it. Take a good look at the makeup of the ZHB. Two members are the same township supervisors (Dougherty and Kearney) that voted for CVS and Commerce Bank. I don't think it would be much of a streach for them to vote for a new bank at Bud's Bar's location. Things are finally looking up for Joe the "Norristown Councilman" DeDominic, Go for it Joe, what do you have to loose!

Anonymous said...

I have a feeling Dougherty and/or Kearney will make a reappearance on the board before the end of this year...or at least rumor has it one of them will be filling out the rest of a board member's term. As I said before, Mr. DiDomenic should have jumped on the band wagon when he had the chance. I do feel his frustration but if his business is so bad, why does he not try and sell it as a restaurant/bar "as-is". Why does everyone on that corner think they're owed millions of dollars?? I can't ask the LP Board of Supervisors to rezone my property so I can lure a big developer for big $$....or can I??? I'm amazed at the attitude of entitlement of some of the business owners around LP. They're no more special than any other business owner in this or any of the surrounding townships and yet expect special treatment. From the Nase family to Dr. Patel....Mr. Didomenic, I think you'd want to exclude yourself from the formentioned. If you think you are entitled and hold resentment towards whomever, it's just going to prolong the inevitable...you will remain owning and operating Bud's Bar which when you purchased it was what you told the Times Herald you wanted back in 1997...someting about wanting it to be a family place where everyone could come and enjoy food and drink. Stan...do you have that article from 1997?

Anonymous said...

ARC in LP is a great idea. Take a look at the LP Map of the area...it has the possibility of connecting with the "Iron Bridge" that goes to Port Kennedy (VF Park). It will be all in the "Prior" Planning to make the whole project come together. Take note the LP Map has a few mistakes in the spelling one being "Fatland" they have it spelled Flatland. Now, how does "Bud's Bar" fit in with "History"...read about the area during the Revolutionary War era

Anonymous said...

"Do you really think your going to find a Supervisor that will tell you why they did the ordinance change?"

Ask Chris Dipaolo. He was the leader of the Grange Avenue Bridge group. He, together with the Friends of Lower Providence, helped stir the hornets nest for the whole CVS and Commerce Bank fiasco. He based his whole campaign on one small corner of a 15 square mile Township. That in the end is what caused this Village Commercial Ordinance change.

Now he is the leader of The Village Commercial Committee, an ad hoc group of his buddies. They've been together for over six months now and have made no progress.

I don't know how soon I would plan to retire Mr. DeDominic. At the rate this is going, you might have to wait until 2011.

Anonymous said...

HELP HELP HELP HELP ME PLEASE:

Your front page of July 25th states "Bud's owner goes on the record" has a quote from the Chairman " In an effort to end the litigation and bring peace back to the community," Dininny said, "we led the village commercial ordinance back to its orgins. We asked Chris DiPaolo to lead a committee to work on the ordinance." Dininny said the committee's work and a Montgomery County Planning Commission review process could take up to a year to complete. "It becomes difficult when people want quick answers on development." On channel 10 news on the 24th at 11:00, Mr. Dunbar the Township Manager stated that the ordinance was in the hands of the village commercial committee.
As the writer on the 25th at 10:30P.M. states "Mr DiPialo is the head of an AD Hoc committee of his buddies and have been togeather for six months and have made no progress.Here's where the help comes in. When does this committee meet.? Please tell me who his buddies are. Are you interested in joining the committee? From what Mr. Dininny stated the committee has six months to go, right? What's the hurry? Who's to benefit?

Anonymous said...

Somebody must see a story out there! Now the television stations are picking up on the Bud's dilemma. Congrats to the TH for being FIRST to see it, because apparently other media outlets see a value in the story. I totally agree the ARC would be good for LP. I also think the ARC would be more successful if u could get to it easily. And who doesnt agree that if a center such as that and what it "brings to the table" wouldnt be better if the eyesore up the street was gone and replaced by a "village-type" of building like Commerce is? Anyone?

Anonymous said...

"Fair and balanced"? You are letting your Fox News influences show!

Stacie Dale said...

Here's what I think should have happened. When The Nase Family was approached by CVS and requested the zoning change from the Township, our township Supervisors and Mike Siegel ( Director of Community Development)should have had a meeting with the 4 corner property owners and all of the residents on Willow Ave., Egypt rd., Pawlings, Park and Lark Lane to discuss what other feasible improvements could be made to the interesection. Residents and business owners could have discussed this together and come up with a plan that made sense for everybody. Mike Siegel should have been instrumental in finding other businesses that wanted to move in to the intersection that would have been acceptable to everyone involved.
What happened instead? CVS got to run the show and made a few concessions after lots of legal action an arguing from FLP. Bud's Bar and Cumberland Farms got left out of the plan. Residents were not included in the desicion making process until the plan was almost complete and now everyone is angry. If we don't work together as a community when there are opportunities for improvement, somebody is going to get the short end of the stick.
I'm not saying it is the fault of the Supervisors. Remember that is a part-time job and they only get paid about $4000 a year. But someone on township staff should have facilitated a much more amicable approach to improving the intersection. Comapnies like CVS and Commerce ahve tons of money and are willing to make concessions if asked. I think we have been too quick to give away our township to the first person that comes along. We ( residents and business owners) should start asking for things instead of having them shoved on us in ways that don't make the best sense. I hope that with the ARC coming in, there will be more effort on the part of the township to find suitable business to coincide. No property owner is entitled to anything more than what they bought. Really, the Nase's and Dr. Patel should not have been given the zoning exception without the consent of other proerty owners who have the same VC zoning. Again, singling out and working with one property owner isn't the way to bring progress to a whole area. Please do better to work together next time before people feel like they don't matter.

Stacie Dale

Back to school said...

Yo Stan,

These people really need spell check on your comment posting, any way that can happen???

Anonymous said...

Why doesnt LP just keep stamping approved on 6 or 7 more liquor licenses in the township? Heck, they are already more than half a dozen over what they are "supposed" to have by the per capita guidelines. Why not 6 or 7 more bars and we can make it a South Street type area. I dont normally feel sorry for property owners whose real estate is worth what it is, but when your business, in this case bar/restaurant, is, in effect, destroyed by the competition of big dollar franchises whose liquor licenses were stamped APPOROVED by township officials AND you cant live by the same VC ordinance rules as your neighbors, thus making your property a "tough sell", as dictated by the SAME townships officials, who the heck would WANT to do business in that township? Sounds like a hard sell for Mr. DeDominic. The way the rules are now, who needs the aggravation?

Anonymous said...

Please people, no one got the short end of the stick. PLEASE, instead of shooting off your blogs,
check the ordinance that involves Village Commercial. Bud's bar did not have the neccessary acreage to put a bank on that corner, old or new ordinance. And, it did not have anything to do with swimming pools. Is'nt T.V. great. They should check out the facts before going on air.

celticwarrior said...

Once the whole Pawlings/Egypt/Park intersection is finished being widened and paved in a week or two, the reasoning of anyone and everyone who voted for CVS/Commerce at any level (BOS, Planning, Zoning) will be very evident. It was in the best interests of ALL LPT residents, not just special interest groups. No election day is required to devine the obvious.

Maybe the fortune tellers in LPT who think they have a clue what's going on with anything AND that they can predict who's going to run for what can make themselves useful and pick Saturday's Powerball numbers.

Anonymous said...

Townships boards are usually made up of people who are appointed for political reasons rather than having the abilities to anticipate the fruits of their decisions.

In LP it looks like they were trying to cut the baby in half and gave into needed changes for the CVS and former Inn, and the unneccesary changes for the Bank then bowed down to the FLP to keep unchanged the gas station and the bar that is visually offensive and physically obstructive to traffic.
It's obvious the bar building will be forced to be removed in the near future, common sense would dictate making that easier and less expensive for the township by a prompt change in zoning.

Anonymous said...

The best solution would be to widen Egypt Road to 5 lanes from 422 all the way to at least 363. But, this being Pennsyltucky, that will never happen, because we like to grant developers the green light on their project, but, by golly, by allowing roads to be widened, that hurts our quality of life. It's like the old saying goes: we shove 5 lanes of traffic onto 2 lane roads.

Anonymous said...

Sigh.....evryone guessing....check out the Royal Bank that is up the street on Egypt Rd!!!! Not enough room is not a true statement...maybe not enuf room for a Commerce or a CitiBank, but plenty for a small bank branch...please get the facts before u speak, this is getting to the point of embarassment....everyone here "KNOWS", and they dont!!!!!!!!!!1

Anonymous said...

Sigh Sigh Sigh.

Royal Bank is the reason the acreage and drive thru was put into the ordinance. Ye of little knowledge should not open ye mouth until ye knows what they are talking about!!

Anonymous said...

I would very strongly suggest that "Anonymous" in his/her 7/27/07 blog regarding the building of the Royal Bank on Egypt Road please check the property zoning before commenting or pointing the finger again. The Royal Bank property is not Village Commercial as is Bud"s Bar, but General Commercial and a permitted use regardless of size. When one knows the facts the picture changes dramatically.

Anonymous said...

Many LPT citizens need to know the real picture. The Township had an intersection Pawlings, Park and Egypt that was on the 12 year TIP for improvement by PADOT. In the meantime, our neighbor, Upper Providence keeps building away, bringing more congestion to an intersection that is already failing. Why the residents of Audubon do not complain to Upper Providence is beyond explantion. Many residents however did complain to the Township that they could not even get to the existing Audubon Village Shopping Center because of the traffic backup and the timing of the signal by PADOT. What is the Township to supposed to do? Wait 12 years or longer? One only has to look how long it took the Grange Ave bridge to be considered for improvements. So the Township supervisors and staff took the bold approach and decided to get a developers to do the work rather than waiting another 20 years saving the township taxpayers millionns of dollars. By the way, if the Township had let PADOT do the improvements since it is their roads, the Audubon Inn would not have been preserved because it is not listed on the historical register. Regardless as Mr.Spock would say "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few-- or one"

Anonymous said...

If the process of improving the intersection was sped up by negotiating the improvement of the Audubon Inn, then it would follow the intersection can be completed ny allowing business transactions with consistent zoning to occur that would allow the "Bud's Bar" to be razed and the appropriate traffic lanes to be installed at the developers expense.

Complaints about the bright color of the paint pale after all the years the the dark near derelict building stood there impeding commercial growth and traffic safety.
The concern that the Friends of LP showed toward the Inn resulted in an overall improvement. Isn't that improvement their mission, in whatever form it takes.

Then there is the issue of Upper Providence development impinging on traffic flow in Lower Providence. Doesn't that speak to the need for regional zoning boards and having non- developers on the Montco Planning Board.

Anonymous said...

The last statement made by "Anonymous" makes no sense at all. It is apparent that this writer has connected a half dozen subjects into a paragraph saying absolutely nothing. Pe chance does this person have an axe to grind and the inability to express himself? I think the latter. Please try again.

Anonymous said...

People can't sit around twiddling their thumbs and blaming Upper Providence for LP's traffic woes. We are in a region, folks. Yes, a metropolitan region. I know many are against simple luxuries such as street lighting, curbs, and adequate roads, but that doesn't change the fact that we are in a metro region. And guess what? Traffic happens in a region. The question is how LP wants to handle it. Should we bury our heads in a cornfield, like we normally do, or actually try and be proactive and improve things?

Anonymous said...

Sigh SIGH SIGH SIGH

You know, they still know it all!!! The Royal Bank being VC ordinance or not is immaterial, it was a POINT made that there is enough ROOM for a bank branch. Before u take someone, anonymous or not, to task, maybe, just maybe, u will actually READ the comment and know it wasnt about VC ordinances, it was about SPACE.

Anonymous said...

Dear Sigh Sigh: From your comment, I think the room I can see is between your ears! Regardless of the size of the property it still comes down to the Zoning Ordinance and the LAW. Celtic Slayer

Anonymous said...

Slayer....we all know it is about ordinance and LAW, just like CVS and Commerce were...that, I THOUGHT, was a given that that was the understanding....just hate seeing untrue statements in all the blogs. My only points was there IS enuf space.

Anonymous said...

There was. Celtic Slayer

Free Documentaries said...

Royal Bank is the reason the acreage and drive thru was put into the ordinance. Ye of little knowledge should not open ye mouth until ye knows what they are talking about!!